Oh, Hhow Tthings Hhave Cchanged- Wealth Inequality

Submitted by: llaa 3 years ago

21 Hard to Believe Facts about Wealthy America
There are 65 comments:
Male 1,692
@papajon0s1

I believe the intention of the article is to dispel many many myths propagated in the media, like those how awesome America is and such...

@oldollie

hahaha, you crazy cranky old wanka, keep it up! :P
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Male 579
And? - that`s response to this article. We are already massively redistributing wealth under Obama (in fairness, Bush did some as well), and where has rewarding those that can but won`t got us? I`m all for helping those that cannot help themselves, but woe to you who can but won`t. When I am king things will change.
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Male 15,832
@llaa There`s a lot more to a business model than choosing a product to sell. But I guess you would have to know something about business to understand that.
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Male 1,692
@pazerlenis

That ones was free since Im a nice person. I`ve seen a lot of friend`s businesses get borked because of that...
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Male 1,692
I say that money earned for the smaller fish in the cities or towns decayed. People`s lives decayed is more important than the town and their decay will rot a town from the inside-out by shutting out independently minded entrepreneurs from competing.
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Male 10,845
[quote]Heck after the small businesses stores closed down, those bargain prices disappeared and even more heinous over pricing became the norm when the consumer had no other choice but to use the monopoly corp`s services or none at all.[/quote]

...and yet Blockbuster is getting replaced by Netflix, Gamefly, and Amazon. Walmart is having to contend with Costco who pays their workers more. In any case those store fronts became home to new businesses in different sectors, and I seriously doubt your town decayed afterwards.
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Male 1,380
@llaa, "Also, be careful running a small business. It seems to be that the larger companies get all the breaks and the small business pays the differnce. Here`s some advice, makes sure you never have a high Dunn and Bradstreet rating. Banks and broke cities will fleece yah where they can... so dont pay bills on time unless you must."

What great advice! Finally my policy of taking business financial advice from strangers on the Internet will finally pay off!!!
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Male 1,692
Also, be careful running a small business. It seems to be that the larger companies get all the breaks and the small business pays the differnce. Here`s some advice, makes sure you never have a high Dunn and Bradstreet rating. Banks and broke cities will fleece yah where they can... so dont pay bills on time unless you must.
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Male 1,692
@oldollie

"If your business model is obsolete, you don`t compete; you get replaced."

This doesn`t make sense when a largely visible examples are large corporations like blockbuster video or starbucks opens a store across the street from a small family owned competitor and prices their similar products at a loss in order to shutdown competitors. I remember many family owned video stores and coffee shops that were much better than those two corporate examples, unfortunately those places are memories, the loss of those shops wasnt because they were obsolete. Heck after the small businesses stores closed down, those bargain prices disappeared and even more heinous over pricing became the norm when the consumer had no other choice but to use the monopoly corp`s services or none at all.
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Male 15,832
[quote]You cannot compare the wealth of 1 person with the combined wealth of millions of people. [/quote]
That`s why I never did that, f***tard. However, those millions or small shareholders can band together and vote out the board if they think they`re not acting in their best interest. That`s the beauty of a corporation: the ones who have their asses our the farthest have the most to say about how things are run. In a democracy, though, the parasites can boss the working people around and take their stuff, particularly since Obama has now created a permanent majority of free riders.

That`s what makes a corporation morally superior to a democracy.
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Male 458
@MeGrendel:

Finite means having limits or bounds.

Just because YOUR definition doesn`t have that specific word doesn`t mean it`s not finite.

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Male 458
@MeGrendel:
Constant is not `finite`. Total up the amount of wealth in the world. It is a finite number.

*facepalm*
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Male 458
@OldOllie:
Those stockholders are dividing that wealth among thousands or millions of people. Those on the board of directors or as CEO are sitting on a large portion of that stock.

You cannot compare the wealth of 1 person with the combined wealth of millions of people.

Idiot.
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Male 15,832
[quote]Exactly made his point. All the wealth is becoming concentrated into a few mega companies. [/quote]
...which are owned by millions of individual stockholders, many of whom are also employees. You, too, can be an owner of Wal-mart. Just go online tomorrow morning and buy yourself 100 shares.

I happen to have started a business fairly recently, and trust me, Wal-mart is the LEAST of my problems. The biggest obstacle I have to face is do-gooder government bureaucrats who like to think that they have the public`s best interest at heart but in fact, they are preventing a live-saving technology from being made available because it doesn`t conform to some stupid, arbitrary, irrelevant rules that were made 30 years ago.
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Female 1,803
"If your business model is obsolete, you don`t compete; you get replaced."

Exactly made his point. All the wealth is becoming concentrated into a few mega companies. Apparently you like being at the mercy of mega companies. Bring on Umbrella Corp! And say goodbye to any means of a regular person starting a business and working their way to wealth.
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Female 1,803
"Also...if you earn over $35,000, you are in the top 1% of income earners worldwide. So, most of the people we classify as "poor" in America, after taxes and transfers, are in the top 1%."

Which only matters if all our poor suddenly moves to a third world country. You are only "well-off" relative to where you live. I make good money for the suburbs of MN but I would be pretty poor if I tried living in Manhattan or Seattle.
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Male 15,832
[quote]So how can a local business compete with big box stores like WalMart? [/quote]
The same way buggy makers competed with car companies. The same way ice men completed with refrigerators. The same way telegraphs competed with email. The same way VCRs competed with DVDs and Netflix. The same way floppy disks competed against thumb drives.

If your business model is obsolete, you don`t compete; you get replaced.
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Male 15,832
[quote]I thought most people would be happy will food, clothes, clean water, a roof, and family. [/quote]
All I need is tight pussy, loose shoes, and a warm place to $#!+.
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Male 15,832
[quote]Is the current British and American financial sector even part of the free market?[/quote]
No.
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Male 1,380
"Nope, the $35,000 is in purchasing power parity terms -- i.e., it does take into account differences in costs of living."

Your 35K number is PPP? Then where did you get this number from? I`d love to see it since every number I`ve seen has it closer to 12-13K range...
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Male 371
@pazerlenis: Nope, the $35,000 is in purchasing power parity terms -- i.e., it does take into account differences in costs of living.
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Male 1,380
@MeGrendel, "So, it would appear that `finite` has doubled. Ergo, it is entirely possible to create wealth."

Ummm, ok. I never said wealth was constant. I never said wealth couldn`t be created. I simply said wealth is not infinite. What exactly is your definition of infinite? Because right now I`m not even sure what point you are trying to make.
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Male 7,329
pazerlenis-"The definition of Wealth is "an abundance of valuable possessions or money." "

Okay, no where in the definition appears the word `constant` or `finite`.

pazerlenis-"Valuable possessions and Money are both finite."

Here`s a clue:
Global Wealth has grown 4.9% so far this year.
It grew 7.8% in 2012.
In fact, since 2000, Global Wealth has more than doubled, from $110 Trillion to $223 Trillion

So, it would appear that `finite` has doubled.

Ergo, it is entirely possible to create wealth.
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Male 1,380
@AntEconomist, "if you earn over $35,000, you are in the top 1% of income earners worldwide."

Well that sounds good until you take into account cost of living. $35,000 in many places in Africa will get you a VERY nice living. Try that in New York and you`ll be lucky to find a nice cardboard box to live in.

So you can`t really compare how much money we have vs. others without also accounting for how much everything costs.

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Male 458
Also, you and someone else took my post out of context. Let me repeat, at any given point there is a finite amount of wealth. This means there is an exact amount of wealth at this very second. For you to claim that I`m wrong is to say wealth is infinite. Even if wealth grows slowly over time, the wealth is still finite. It does not go on forever. The growth of wealth over time over the last 30 years in the west has been siphoned to the top. Thus, those at the top have become extraordinarily wealthier, while those at the middle and bottom have had stagnant wages.

It`s very obvious that money has been filtered to the top, but you refuse to do the basic calculus in your head to figure out why.
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Male 458
@OldOllie:
So how can a local business compete with big box stores like WalMart? These companies lobby for the law to be in their favor, own their own distribution centers, and even cut the quality of their own products to make more money so they can sell it cheaper to the consumer.

If you honestly think simple hard work leads to wealth, then why aren`t you a billionaire? Why aren`t people who clean hospitals millionaires?

People like you forget that luck plays a larger role in being rich than hard work ever does.
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Male 458
@OldOllie:
You fail at reading comprehension. I said AT ANY GIVEN POINT wealth is finite. It does grow, but growth is slow over time.

You apparently don`t know the difference between arithmetic and differential/integral calculus.
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Male 371
@pazerlenis. The phrase "balance between consumer and producer" has no meaning.
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Male 371
Also...if you earn over $35,000, you are in the top 1% of income earners worldwide. So, most of the people we classify as "poor" in America, after taxes and transfers, are in the top 1%.
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Male 1,380
@AntEconomist, "how is it possible that 7 billion people today can consume more (on average) than 1 billion did a thousand years ago?"

I never said it was constant. I`m just saying it cannot be INFINITE. In order for something to be of value, there has to be a limited amount of it.

Take Oxygen for example. We need it to survive, but on Terra Firma its so abundant that is has little value (no one is offering money to breathe). Yet even with that imbalance Oxygen is finite (just ask any scuba diver or astronaut).

Its about the balance between consumers and product, not about if its finite or not. That`s the point I`m trying to make.
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Male 1,380
@OldOllie, "It sounds more like centrally planned leftist fascism to me."

Leftist Fascism? I thought they all were Socialist? Seriously, are you just randomly pointing to words on a political spectrum chart to come up with your comebacks? If I didn`t know better I`d think you were a neo-nazi, hippie, socialist-libertarian.
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Male 371
[ Edit Profile ][ Delete Post ]Sunday, November 10, 2013 10:43:35 AM@pazerlenis If the amount of wealth in the world is constant, how is it possible that 7 billion people today can consume more (on average) than 1 billion did a thousand years ago?
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Male 1,380
@OldOllie, "The wealth in the world is not finite. It can be created, and it can be destroyed (consumed)."

Basic laws of supply and demand say otherwise. You need a balance between what is created and what is consumed. Too many consumers will shoot the value too high and too few people will be able to get it. Too much of the valued item and its perceived value drops to zero/near-zero. So the second part of your statement is true, but it doesn`t prove your argument that wealth is infinite.

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Male 1,380
@MeGrendel, "mesovortex-`there is a finite amount of wealth in the world.` Aaaaaaaaaaannnnnnd you lose."

The definition of Wealth is "an abundance of valuable possessions or money." Valuable possessions and Money are both finite. They HAVE to be in order to be of value. Your 8th grade economics class should`ve taught you that.
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Male 1,016
The problem lies with the stock market/ IPO method of raising capital.Once a company does this they become shackled to the shareholder and obligated to have higher yearly returns. they can`t increase cost to the consumer so they cut cost on salaries and benefits.All that happens is the owners lose control of their original vision and some corporate entity makes the decision .
I have high respect for Michael Dell for buying back his company and going private again!
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Male 371
Also...if you earn over $35,000, you are in the top 1% of income earners worldwide. So, most of the people we classify as "poor" in America, after taxes and transfers, are in the top 1%.
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Male 371
Why does the inequality crowd keep quoting "pre-tax" income when decrying inequality. We have a tax system that is designed to reduce inequality. Let`s see how it works...

Before taxes and transfers: 40% of workers make $20,000 or less.

After taxes and transfers: 40% of workers make $40,000 or less.

Before taxes and transfers: 60% make less than $40,000.

After taxes and transfers: 60% make less than $60,000.
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Male 4,431
HumanAction, I`m not the one pretending that those on public assistance are rolling up in luxury cars, using food stamps to buy Dom Perignon and lobster, etc. I`m not the one with lame-assed anecdotal stories about things like that as if somehow that proves that income inequality and poverty are 100% the fault of the person in that situation. Just like, apparently, cancer is 100% the fault of the person who contracts it...
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Male 2,357
[quote]Oh, they live in mansions and eat lobster, drive Mercedes, have iPods and Internet and cable and iPhones.[/quote]
Holy sh*t. When did this become the standard for having a decent life? I thought most people would be happy will food, clothes, clean water, a roof, and family.
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Male 440
All you have to do is compare our "poor" to the poor of any other nation. We don`t have poor here.
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Female 1,803
"clearly if you are poor you must be lazy."

More likely you don`t have a well-off family that makes sure you get a good education and the connections you need to get a head start on your own wealth. People tend to stay in the status they are born in because they don`t have any idea how the next status works and how to get in it. A fortunate few are able to figure it out but most can`t. With the current trend of CEO salaries exploding and the lowly worker`s wages staying the same, it`s even less likely that people will change their status by working hard.
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Male 5,891
clearly if you are poor you must be lazy.
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Male 5,874
Poverty? Take a lesson from India and expand your space budget.
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Male 7,775
Get the plebs to turn on each other- Mission accomplished.
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Male 4,431
God, I love it when people (read: conservatives) start spewing about how great those in poverty or on welfare have it. Oh, they live in mansions and eat lobster, drive Mercedes, have iPods and Internet and cable and iPhones.

Yeah, right. Try it then, if it`s so effing great. Ignorance is certainly bliss. And ignoring the inherent inequity, the almost insurmountable inequity in our society for all but the very few lucky who can actually move from the bottom to even middle class is truly and completely amazing. I know where you`ll be when you get sick and insurance can`t pay for it. With you had out toward Medicaid. And you`ll even do it without irony, and say that you "deserve" it. That`s what chaps my ass.
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Male 4,431
mesovortex, that you think there`s a finite amount of wealth in the world or a country is already an epic, massive fail, so I didn`t read the rest of your post.
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Male 10,339
It is actually. Cost of living isn`t much here at all.
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Male 1,692
@auburnjunky

Ahh, I see. Must be cheap where you live, lucky you.
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Male 714
the word `poverty` is fast loosing its original meaning. Neo-marxists use it as a political weapon to bludgeon opposition, much in the same way the term `racist` has been used. I found myself out of work recently so decided to do some casual labour to tide me over and some of the people who I met had only taken the job because their dole would`ve been stopped and they talked about their big TVs and sky tv package, ps2 etc.

real poverty exists but is far less common than reported.
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Male 10,339
I was speaking of myself. Read it again.
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Male 1,692
"Cable, Internet, Xbox 360, PS3, PC, Laptop, 2 cars, Air Conditioning, Microwave, 2 to 4 Flatscreen TVs, etc. etc."

Ive worked at second hand stores in low income areas and they buy affordable out-dated technology available. Ive sold more vcrs than dvd players at the second shop in South LA.

Maybe those people you claim that have those items may have possibly have stolen those items, but hey they wont have it for long and neither their freedom.
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Male 10,339
"#5 According to numbers that were just released this week, 49.7 million Americans are living in poverty. That is a brand new all-time record high."

Poverty is an arbitrary number set forth by the administration to garner support.

These people who live in "poverty" (I am included) have:

Cable, Internet, Xbox 360, PS3, PC, Laptop, 2 cars, Air Conditioning, Microwave, 2 to 4 Flatscreen TVs, etc. etc.

I am not impoverished. I live below the poverty line, but I know how to save and spend, so I live okay.
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Male 1,692
I dont think it has anything to do with free markets and it has nothing to do with five year plans. It has to do that even the company that first hired Soros as an entry level broker has now been bought by a mulitmational corporation, ING Direct. ING also owns Intuit and Experian.

Is the current British and American financial sector even part of the free market?
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Male 15,832
[quote]From wiki, "On 8 October 2008 the UK Treasury used the Banking (Special Provisions) Act 2008 to transfer Kaupthing Singer and Friedlander Kaupthing Edge deposit business to ING Direct, a wholly owned subsidiary of ING Group, the remainder of Kaupthing Singer and Friedlander`s business was put into administration."

Too Big to Fail Monopolization[/quote]

How does that have anything at all to do with free market economics? It sounds more like centrally planned leftist fascism to me.

But thanks for making my point about Soros. Yeah, he may have made a few thousand bucks doing something marginally worthwhile when he was young, but 99.999% of his money was someone else`s loss. He did not create anything of value in the process.
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Male 1,692
Oh this is totally my point on whats wrong with current affairs:

From wiki, "On 8 October 2008 the UK Treasury used the Banking (Special Provisions) Act 2008 to transfer Kaupthing Singer and Friedlander Kaupthing Edge deposit business to ING Direct, a wholly owned subsidiary of ING Group, the remainder of Kaupthing Singer and Friedlander`s business was put into administration."

Too Big to Fail Monopolization
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Male 1,692
Oh damn those facts! I must troll! Id like to know how people buying businesses and shipping out jobs and the machinery overseas is working hard for their country?

Oh and Soros:
" In a discussion at the Los Angeles World Affairs Council in 2006, Alvin Shuster, former foreign editor of the Los Angeles Times, asked Soros, "How does one go from an immigrant to a financier? ... When did you realize that you knew how to make money?" Soros replied, "Well, I had a variety of jobs and I ended up selling fancy goods on the sea side, souvenir shops, and I thought, that`s really not what I was cut out to do. So, I wrote to every managing director in every merchant bank in London, got just one or two replies, and eventually that`s how I got a job in a merchant bank."[21] That job was an entry-level position in Singer & Friedlander."
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Male 7,329
mesovortex-"there is a finite amount of wealth in the world."

Aaaaaaaaaaannnnnnd you lose.
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Male 15,832
@mesovortex You could be the poster boy for BEI (breathtaking economic ignorance). The wealth in the world is not finite. It can be created, and it can be destroyed (consumed). If all the wealth in the world were equally divided, everyone would not only be poor, they would very quickly starve to death. No one would have enough money to buy a tractor, let alone build a tractor factory.

If you think workers are being underpaid, and companies are overcharging for substandard products, you and your like-minded friends should pool your money, start your own business, and go into competition against these greedy rich bastards. If everything you say is true, you should be able to hire away all their best underpaid workers at a "fair" wage, produce superior quality goods, undercut their unfair prices, and run them out of business.

Go ahead. No one is stopping you.
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Male 15,832
I`m starting to get really sick and tired of this f***tarded socialist bull$#!+ about "wealth inequality." All you libs have this perverted idea that the only way to accumulate wealth is to take it from someone else. That may be true of a a lot of rich liberals. For instance, George Soros has never made a penny in his life that wasn`t someone else`s loss. Same with Al Gore. He has never created anything of value except perhaps his lying-ass movie. At least the idiots who pissed away their money to watch it did so voluntarily.

The fact is, most of the rich got that way by CREATING valuable products and services that enrich the lives of everyone INCLUDING the poor. This is new wealth that did not exist before they created it and would not exist at all were it not for the rich. All poor people do is consume it, turn it into $#!+, and then bitch about the people who made it possible for them to have it in the first place.

Ungrateful bastards one and all.
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Male 1,059
Thank 100 years of progressivism for this sorry state of affairs.
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Male 458
@soundman655:
You must have not been a very good math student. At any given point there is a finite amount of wealth in the world. Not everyone can be millionaires or billionaires, and if wealth was divided equally everyone would be in the middle class and no one would be rich.

Hard work doesn`t mean you`ll automatically be rich. Plenty of people work hard and aren`t rich.

Further, if you want to actually do the math, realize that a pay cut for low wage earners can yield a boatload of profits for those at the top simply because small cuts multiplied out yields huge profits. If you don`t believe me, take a look at how stores like Wal Mart have taken gradual cuts and shortcuts in the quality of their goods over time to yield enormous profit margins. Those at the bottom suffer, and those at the top get richer.
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Male 4,431
Yep, it`s all the fault of the poor. And Obama. And taxes! Because trickle down economics works, by golly! Just look at the results!
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Male 1,444
Things have changed, why only yesterday "Hhow" had one h, Tthings had one t,......
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Male 1,558
Blame the poor for lack of knowledge about how to use $$ correctly. A simple savings account isn`t enough. Find out why!
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Male 1,692
Link: Oh, Hhow Tthings Hhave Cchanged- Wealth Inequality [Rate Link] - 21 Hard to Believe Facts about Wealthy America
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